RE: Vapor lock?
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RE: Vapor lock? - 10/4/2007 9:06:09 PM
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blueshark
Posts: 2170
Joined: 7/20/2006
From: Dickson, TN.
Status: offline
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Hi Mech,
Thanks for jumping in.You had describe a procedure for me to follow not too long ago, to check the fuel system. It all checked out. at that time. You may remember, I was checking because of long cranking times but that turned out to be a dragging starter and worn solenoid.
In the past when it would stall it would not start at all and twice turned out to be the fuel pump and the other was the ECM in the distributor.
Would the relay stop intermittently or just stop altogether? They are printed boards right? not points like they used to be? The pump comes on just like it is supposed to and builds great pressure instantly. Tt holds the pressure while running and increases slightly with susstained acceleration and settles back down.
Is it normal for the pump to run-on after the ignition is off? This is a new thing. I always try to pay close attention to my cars but I really don't remember hearing the run-on of the pump before. would the fuel pressure regulator allow this if it were going bad? Also the pressure does bleed down after a short while, after the ignition is off, which I believe is normal, right?
The MAF connection is good but being yet another electronic gadget, it could be on it's way out. I need to check this if there is a way. Any tell tails on this one?
This time when it wouldn't start right away it did fire but seemed as though it was lacking fuel. Injector pulse? Guess I need to buy a noid light huh? What size?
The clicking I hear is coming from behind and under the battery. This may be completely seperate from the stall or the run on, but....There is a small contraption down there with several wires attached, what might that be?
Geesh ...sorry it so long here.
_____________________________
God Speed Rich.
www.larosadesign.net
Design, Engineering,Tooling
www.stantonscustomrods.net
"Welcome to Tennessee,
The patron state of shootin' stuff".......Shooter
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RE: Vapor lock? - 10/6/2007 7:28:26 AM
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mech259
Posts: 1759
Joined: 1/22/2006
From: Lumberton, Texas
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blueshark
Hi Mech,
Thanks for jumping in.You had describe a procedure for me to follow not too long ago, to check the fuel system. It all checked out. at that time. You may remember, I was checking because of long cranking times but that turned out to be a dragging starter and worn solenoid.
In the past when it would stall it would not start at all and twice turned out to be the fuel pump and the other was the ECM in the distributor.
Would the relay stop intermittently or just stop altogether? They are printed boards right? not points like they used to be?
No, fuel pump relays still have the coil and poits setup to handle the amp draw of the fuel pump.
quote:
The pump comes on just like it is supposed to and builds great pressure instantly. Tt holds the pressure while running and increases slightly with susstained acceleration and settles back down.
Is it normal for the pump to run-on after the ignition is off?
Yes
quote:
This is a new thing. I always try to pay close attention to my cars but I really don't remember hearing the run-on of the pump before. would the fuel pressure regulator allow this if it were going bad? Also the pressure does bleed down after a short while, after the ignition is off, which I believe is normal, right?
How quick does it bleed down? Bleed down can be caused by leaking injector, regulator, or check valve in the pump.
quote:
The MAF connection is good but being yet another electronic gadget, it could be on it's way out. I need to check this if there is a way. Any tell tails on this one?
This time when it wouldn't start right away it did fire but seemed as though it was lacking fuel. Injector pulse? Guess I need to buy a noid light huh? What size?
The clicking I hear is coming from behind and under the battery. This may be completely seperate from the stall or the run on, but....There is a small contraption down there with several wires attached, what might that be?
There are 3 relays in that area, but I will have to go and look at my 86 to see what you are talking about.
quote:
Geesh ...sorry it so long here.
_____________________________
L.B.
ASE Master Certified
L1 Emissions Certified
1986 C4
1969 RS Z28 Camaro
1970 Chevelle SS 396 (under construction)
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RE: Vapor lock? - 10/6/2007 12:55:19 PM
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blueshark
Posts: 2170
Joined: 7/20/2006
From: Dickson, TN.
Status: offline
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The pressure will bleed down in about 20 minutes.
I can't believe I never heard the pump run on before.LOL! Better pay even closer attention than usual,huh? I guess this car is 20 years old after all.
If the injectors were leaking wouldn't there be smoke and the smell of gas at startup? I get neither of these symptoms. But ....?
The clicking doesn't seem to be coming from the two relays I can see but from under the battery. I didn't notice any down there when I changed the battery out awhile back. just what looks like some sort of distribution contraption down in there. you have to look down in the space behind the battery. ??? It has a post instead of a plug like a relay.
What are the regulators like on the inside. is it something like a spring loaded pressure sensitive diaphragm as in an air regulator ? Looks like it would be a PITA to change out with my fat fingers, LOL!
_____________________________
God Speed Rich.
www.larosadesign.net
Design, Engineering,Tooling
www.stantonscustomrods.net
"Welcome to Tennessee,
The patron state of shootin' stuff".......Shooter
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RE: Vapor lock? - 10/6/2007 1:12:19 PM
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rshiver
Posts: 381
Joined: 8/4/2007
Status: offline
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Hi Blueshark, I went out and listened to mine. I really didn't hear a clicking, but I did hear something, sounded more like a small electric motor that ran for about two seconds after I shut the engine off.
I do have one relay directly behind the battery, and I have no idea what it's for. And I think I see the "contraption" you're referring to, and it does look like a distribution outlet where the wires go through the firewall.
_____________________________
"Giving up" is never an option.
..............(o o)
~~~o00o~(_)~o00o~~~
2000 Limited Edition Ford F-350 Lariat 4x4 Dually, 7.3 Liter Powerstroke Diesel
1985 L98 Corvette
1978 Chevy Camaro LT
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RE: Vapor lock? - 10/6/2007 1:20:41 PM
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blueshark
Posts: 2170
Joined: 7/20/2006
From: Dickson, TN.
Status: offline
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Hey rshiver, Thanks for lookin' at yours. I guess the electric motor we hear is the fuel pump. I can hear what sounds like fuel filling the rail as well. Again, I don't remember hearing this before. I'm wondering if my pressure regulator is on it's way out, unless, God forbid, the dang injectors are going bad. But..... like I said, no smoke or smell of fuel at start-up....? No wonder why I like carburetors so much, LOL!
_____________________________
God Speed Rich.
www.larosadesign.net
Design, Engineering,Tooling
www.stantonscustomrods.net
"Welcome to Tennessee,
The patron state of shootin' stuff".......Shooter
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RE: Vapor lock? - 10/6/2007 1:29:44 PM
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rshiver
Posts: 381
Joined: 8/4/2007
Status: offline
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It's got me curious now, ...It may have been the fuel going through the fuel rail or the fuel going through the pressure regulator.??
Hey Mech...would the fuel pump continue to run until the oil pressure dropped below 4 psi??
_____________________________
"Giving up" is never an option.
..............(o o)
~~~o00o~(_)~o00o~~~
2000 Limited Edition Ford F-350 Lariat 4x4 Dually, 7.3 Liter Powerstroke Diesel
1985 L98 Corvette
1978 Chevy Camaro LT
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RE: Vapor lock? - 10/6/2007 2:02:03 PM
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mech259
Posts: 1759
Joined: 1/22/2006
From: Lumberton, Texas
Status: offline
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20 minutes bleed off is acceptable, fact, pretty normal. 10 - 20 seconds is not. Have you checked fuel pressure and spark in the sluggish starting condition? No trouble codes I presume? Need at least 25 to 30 lbs of fuel pressure, maintained, for successful starts. Have you checked spark plugs for fouling? If you have a spark checker to check spark, that would be better than a spark plug because it stresses the coil to at least 20 kv.
_____________________________
L.B.
ASE Master Certified
L1 Emissions Certified
1986 C4
1969 RS Z28 Camaro
1970 Chevelle SS 396 (under construction)
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