Hard Starting
 

When my 88 is cold she fires right up. When she is warmed up, she cranks and cranks and I have to pump the gas to get it started.. It takes about 5 seconds.. This is not right. Any help appreciated...

RE: Hard Starting
 

I have the same problem in my car and i am HOPEFULLY going to be taking it to a corvette specialist tomorrow and ask them what they think it is.

In my car though, it used to fire up when it was cold, but now it doesnt fire up right away EVER. I have to crank it up and pump the gas EVERY single time. Anyway, i will relay whatever they tell me to you and hopefully we can get rid of this un-godly and embarassing problem!

RE: Hard Starting
 

you may have a leaking fuel injector. check the fuel pressure and let us know!

RE: Hard Starting
 

I was told the same thing Raisin... i just changed all of my fuel injectors and still have the same problem. I went from the stock 22lbs/hr or whatever it was to 30lbs/hr and the problem still exists.

RE: Hard Starting
 

Did you look at my post in the other forum (Injector Help) on the same subject on what else to check?

RE: Hard Starting
 

Yes sir i sure did. I had the fuel pressure checked today and they said it was fine. I didnt check the spark or anything else but the guy (an actual Corvette SPECIALIST this time) told me to change my spark plugs and wires because the dumb @$$e$ that worked on my car put Bosch Plugs and probably the CHEAPEST wires they could find on it. The guy told me he had never seen that kind of wires ever, much less on a Corvette. Which means he either hasnt seen that many wires (not likely because ive never even heard of the type and couldnt tell you the name without running out to my car to check if the name is even on the wires, and because he has about 20 vettes sitting outside of his shop right now) or that they are just very crappy wires. And so I am going to change the wires and plugs and he said that if thats not the problem, he would like to run a diagnostic on it, but he said he is pretty sure it would be the distributor, as my car is approching the 100K mark in the next 2 weeks (based off of my average mileage every week). SOOOOOO, fille9, what kind of plugs and wires do you have in your car? You might check that. But also the fuel pressure like mech is saying. That could be very helpful.

Oh, and btw mech... I was told by the people that worked on my motor that 30lb injectors would be a good size. I was told by the Corvette guy that 30lbs is something you put on like a 383 or larger motor. He said that the stock 23lb injectors are plenty but if i went to 24lbs, then i would have more than enough. So now i have to get new injectors and take the 30lb ones out. Doesnt it kinda sound like i entrusted my car to these people that are no smarter than a bunch of baboons with wrenches? Just thought i would share that with you.

RE: Hard Starting
 

Sweet Lord, Matt... when you first mentioned that I did think that was quite the large injector size for your setup but also thought those guys knew what they were doing so I kept quiet. I really am quite certain now that your assertion regarding baboons and wrenches and such is pretty much bang on the money. I am so sorry about the woes, bro.... I've never seen anyone have such problems with mechanical work before... you have my best wishes that this stuff gets sorted out for you, and quick now.

RE: Hard Starting
 

I appreciate it Scotty, you always wish me the best :D and i thank you for that. I just cant wait to see the looks on their faces when they realize that i have checked up on everything they did and just because i am 20 years old doesnt mean i dont know sh*t about cars. I probably know more than they know. They have quite a bit coming to them tomorrow. I hope i get off before they close now lol. Or else it will look like i talked a big game but couldnt produce.

Matt

RE: Hard Starting
 

Matt, my friend, you DO know more than those guys. No doubt about it. My stomach is turning for you here this afternoon with all this news. I feel like grabbin some munitions and heading down there to back you up. ARGH! Keep us posted, bro, I am 10000% certain you are going to get to the bottom of all this. I'll definately be thinking of you tomorrow as you fight the good fight.

RE: Hard Starting
 

Yes, 30lb injectors would be quite a bit if your engine doesn't have the stones for it. Back to your hard start, quick, constant fuel pressure is good. Have you checked injector pulse and spark on startup to see if you have both. If you have a scan tool, go to data and see if you have rpm while cranking. If you have instant spark and injector pulse, more than likely your distro is doing its stuff. Obviously if it has spark but not so obvious is the injector pulse, since injector pulse is determined by the low resolution sensor in your opti. It has a high resolution sensor (both optical) for fine tuning spark timing and pulse rate. [8D]

RE: Hard Starting
 

Umm, i havent checked any of that mech. You are almost speaking french to me lol. But i did find out that there is Oil on the inside of my block where my spark plugs go. I was told that it comes from when you have a blown/broken valve stem seal and apparently the oil is preventing my car from starting right up. That is what i understand out of the whole situation. I could be wrong though. But, when i took my car to the guy taht did all of this work today, he told me that the seals arent blown/broken, he said that they valve stems arent sitting right on the valves or something like that. I think he said valves. Anyway... does that sound right to you mech? I just need some help with this... its getting ridiculous

Thanks
Matt

RE: Hard Starting
 

A dead giveaway of valve stem seals is a puff of blue smoke upon engine startup. I have never heard of bad valve seals causing no start condition. Sorry about the French (LOL), but you need to check spark and injector pulse. We have an old saying in my industry, They all have to suck, squeeze, pop, and spit. ;)

RE: Hard Starting
 

Haha, well ive personally never heard of it either but i was told that when that gets taken care of, i should change the spark plugs back to ACDelco's and stay away from the Bosch's i have in there now and also change the crappy wires that the shop i took it to put in there. The Corvette guy i took it to said that if that doesnt take care of the starting problem, i should take it to him and i should have him check the distibutor. I hope it isnt the distributor cause thats EXPENSIVE... lol.

Now, I have noticed this and i dont know if this is just typical or what, but when i relieve the pressure from my fuel system (a.k.a. i take the fuel pump fuse out and run the engine until it cuts off from lack of fuel) and then do whatever i am doing to it and then put the fuse back in and start it back up, it always starts almost right away for about 2 or 3 starts. Then i get to driving it around and try and start it again and it hard starts again. Could this maybe point to something other than the problem areas we have already checked or stated as maybe being a problem?

RE: Hard Starting
 

That really sounds like a hot soak coil problem. That is why you ought to get you a spark checker (they are cheap) and check your spark. It is really getting into an area now where I would use a lab scope to start checking voltage patterns on dist sensors. Another way to check functionality of the distributor is take a 12v test light, clip the lead to 12v positive, touch the probe end to the negative side of the coil and see if it pulses in the no starting episode. [8D]

RE: Hard Starting
 

Hey guys!

I had the exact same problem on my '87 work-in-progress 2 years ago. Everyone kept trying to get very technical with me. Easy enough to do LOL:D

Anyways, turned out to be a bad starter... A little hard to replace by yourself. But, cheap enough[8D]

My 2 cents. Best of luck to ya!

RE: Hard Starting
 

Well i figured it might be the starter, but i was told that if it was cranking over, then its not the starter because it is starting, just not right away. I am hoping that when my mechanic fixes the valve seal problem, it will take care of it. I am pretty sure that it might take care of it because for the first few days after i had my motor rebuilt, it started right up everytime. Then after about 3 days, it started taking quite a while to start. From what i gather from the situation, i would assume that it took a while for the oil to make its way through the seals into the spark plug wire holes and then once it did, it just got in the way of me trying to start my car and so now it takes a while to start. Only time will tell. If thats not the problem, its no big deal to me because he is fixing everything on my motor for free. I will update you guys in a few days... maybe even tomorrow.

Matt

RE: Hard Starting
 

That's what I was wondering. could it be the starter solenoid? mine does the same thing. on the old school cars if the solenoid was bad it wouldn't conduct well after it was hot.and the least little draw on the brand new battery kills it. if the solenoid is bad it could draw major amps. just a thought

RE: Hard Starting
 

well that could be the problem, but it doesnt only do it when the engine is hot. I go to bed and then wake up for work the next morning about 7 or 8 hours later and it hard starts again. I looked in my haynes manual to trouble shoot it but i dont remember exactly what it said. I will look again when i get my car back.

RE: Hard Starting
 

I'm confused. Is the engine turning over but not lighting up after hot soak? :eek:

RE: Hard Starting
 

Well, you can hear the engine trying to start. The starter it trying to crank it up but then the engine doesnt fire up for about 5 or 6 seconds. It doesnt matter wether it is hot or cold. It just takes a while to start.

RE: Hard Starting
 

Ok, well your starter is not the problem and I don't think valve seals are either. You either don't have injector pulse or spark. Easy enought to run down. Try some ether when it won't start and see if it does then. Don't go overboard with it.[8D]

RE: Hard Starting
 

Ok, where do i get ether and where do i put it and how much do i put... Lol, im such a newbie. I am gonna refer back to your other post to check how to see if i have injector pulse or spark. I am SUPPOSED to get my car back on monday now. They didnt even touch it today. Hopefully i get it back then. If i do, i will definately try whatever you suggest and then tell you if it worked.!! Thanks again for your help mech.

Matt

RE: Hard Starting
 

you can get ether at any auto parts, just a light mist into the air intake inlet, just give it a taste, don't drown it. [8D]

RE: Hard Starting
 

Ether = starter fluid. Another question, when its cold does it crank quickly? when its hot does it crank just as quickly? The heat soak on the coil could make it hard to start after it's warmed up, but would not explain the cold starting problem. Also when was the last time you changed the fuel filter? I read on another one of your posts about oil on a spark plug, have you done a comp test? I just dont see a little oil on the plug doing this, unless it's a LOT of oil. And my last question, what are the cold cranking amps on your battery, and how old is it? This one is a shot in the dark but a cheap and easy fix.. good luck.

RE: Hard Starting
 

Ummm... No, it doesnt crank quickly AT ALL... UNLESSSSSS I depressurize (bleed) the fuel system by taking out the f.p. fuse and then cranking the engine over to get all the fuel out of the lines. Then it will start right up for about 3 or 4 starts. then it goes right back to the way it was. It hard starts when it is hot also. The fuel filter was replaced about 3 months ago. It wasnt just a little oil... it was quite a bit. But that is beside the point now because my mechanic told me that the problem was fixed with the oil on the spark plugs. I was going to get a diagnostic this week. Umm, the CCA's is 690 and the CA's is 820 and the battery is not a dry cell battery or whatever they are called and it is at least a year old. It was in the car when i got it.

RE: Hard Starting
 

Sounds like you are getting to much fuel in the combustion chamber. Didn't you put some high flow injectors in? What is your exact fuel pressure reading @ idle and KOEO. Then unplug vacuum line from pressure regulator @ idle and take reading. Have you had a tune put on the engine? I'm just wondering if your flowing to much fuel. Have you physically pulled a few plugs out and see if they look chalky black (gas fouled)? Sorry for all the questions, but we need to start narrowing down your problem. ;)

RE: Hard Starting
 

Also in a earlier reply you said you had changed to #30 injectors, has the computer been tuned for them? It also sounds like a starter or battery system problem, (slow cranking cold and hot). I'm not exactly sure why they put #30 injectors in your car? Did you upgrade heads? or a cam maybe? or both? I'm under the impression you may have more than one issue here.

RE: Hard Starting
 

I have already changed my Injectors back to stock but yes, i do have ungraded heads and cam.