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...and they're OFF
a helper was waitin' for me here...
With 8 legs, he oughtta' be better than a power tool!:DHope he's not all thumbs like me! [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/C670C581F1154D02AE15F62EAB529263.jpg[/IMG] THERE ARE EDITS THROUGHOUT THIS THREAD, WHERE I FOUND OUT A TRICK, OR BETTER SEQUENCE FOR PROCEDURE. FIRST REMOVE THE ENTIRE ASSEMBLY.(SEE POST #5) I WOULD ABSOLUTELY FOLLOWTHIS PROCEDURE - YOU HAVE EXTERIOR SURFACES ALL OVER THIS ASSEMBLY, AND YOU DO NOT WANT TO MAKE THE SAME MISTAKE THAT I JUST DID. |
RE: ...and they're OFF
text edited; pics left...
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RE: ...and they're OFF
text edited...
[IMG]local://upfiles/5243/498D82E3EB3B4C959946697FF1A19885.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/8DC03C1A52BF44978A54F4F7B7D26B69.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
This is the entire assembly. I think there's no way around motor work, without pulling the whole assembly.
edited ... Riddle time: How many bolts can you remove from a vette headlight assembly, and not do anything? Answer: Gimme' a minute; I'm countin' (where's my calculator). [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/09B511990337408899503A94F36F14A7.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
EDIT:
Disconnect headlight power supply. Have ready a towel to put down the assembly. First remove the screws at the lower assembly - with yellow circle. Then remove nuts numbered '1' - at both sides of headlight assembly. Then loosen, BUT DO NOT COMPLETELY REMOVE, the '2' numbered nuts. Get your free hand onto the headlight assembly, and apply pressure. Then remove the two remaining nuts #2. CAREFULLY, pull away the assembly. Removal of the motor from the assembly is at post # 20, in red. Motor disassembly is at post # 32. I have some pics between here #5 and #32 which might be of help. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- later... The roll pin (previous post, blue circle) was tough. I was afraid of manglin' it. I put the penetratin' lube on it, then put the vise grips on it gently and squeezed, so the pin would close a little, and allow the oil to get on the outside of the pin. Turn slowly, and work it - it is tight!!! I didn't pull it all the way out either - below, red circle. Also note the position of the shaft that it came out of, when disassembling the motor. Now go to post 32. [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/9162C5B49C8246D493ED567EDCD51BB3.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
Let it snow!
Hopefully, this powder is the problem. [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/C23FA840C2A549509F09D8A101BC8940.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/21226B27C0954F61B437F5B8279C680C.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
Is that a plastic gear? Did the powder come from the gear? What does the worm gear look like? Inquiry minds wanna to know.
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RE: ...and they're OFF
Yup - it's plastic/nylon. And the previous owner, or somebody for him, has been in there before. The bolt that I showed with a yellow 'x' was gone.
All the parts are cleaned and drying. The plastic gear bein' shredded explains the skip, but not the exact pattern of skipping every single time. 3 seconds of skip after closing, 3 seconds of skip after opening. That's gotta be an electric problem??? When the parts are dry, they'll go back in lubed, till the new gear gets in. I'm probably gonna' go with another nylon gear. If you do a complete disassemble, the only warning is to watch out for a single ball bearing, at the end of the worm drive. There's another 5 ball bearing, with a separate race (washer-like cover), at the other end of the worm drive, inside the manual turn handle. The cover goes to the inside. [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/CF32619A25244837A672E6A9867BD637.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/F9DB418A59BA41C2BBE9C6FC06088264.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
Not necessarily an electrical problem. Even though the gear was stripped, it obviously had enough gear remaining to open and close the assembly,AND, to strain the motor enough after the assembly had bottomed out to trigger the sensor to shut off the motor. I would wait and see how it does after you get everything put back together before I made that call.
Side note...You said that only one side was acting up, kinda makes one wonder how longbefore the other side goes tits up.:eek: |
RE: ...and they're OFF
Yeah good question. And good call on waitin' too...
Here's more pics from re-assembly: [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/F7C92E49726B4ACD969526C0C41E6492.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/3DF0DDC58F864826B6E303D31D7C5D5D.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/6B677D6B8AA1496C9BEFD295D2098475.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
... and more...
notice closely in the second and third picture how the brushes are held into place with fishing line, for the armature to go back into place;) don't lose the line when you put back in the armature... [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/C6996B15D89A418EAD511AE77BD759F7.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/667D12406F2A4E91BE2A9AB187967997.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/E3891C1AB04B4B3582F4410FC3D3F74B.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
remember the lone worm drive ball bearing? Put a dab of grease in the recess at the end of the drive, to hold the bearing.
[IMG]local://upfiles/5243/1CA1BF8AB3D548EB97C228D1AF495242.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/B701B401690B40ACB0CD05D2CB8564BC.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
jammed post[&:][:@]
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RE: ...and they're OFF
I just got jammed again, tryin' to load some more pics, same size. Message is they're too big.
Have I posted too much in this thread? c3? pay? |
RE: ...and they're OFF
EDIT: Nevermind. I found your other thread.
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RE: ...and they're OFF
so whats the verdict...did it fix the problem?
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RE: ...and they're OFF
ORIGINAL: SC300TURBO so whats the verdict...did it fix the problem? Ya' gotta find the problem before ya' fix it. Unless you're employin' the Fully Automatic Assault Wallet approach [sm=shootshoot.gif][sm=violent053.gif]Hit the problem with $340 worth of new parts and HOPE to fix it???. Not my style. I found one worn part. After all parts were cleaned, greased and oiled, and re-assembled, it did exactly what I expected it to do. The same thing. And I'm gonna' go with a nylon gear - not bronze. Now that I see how easy it is, I'd still rather do it again in 3 years, than replace the entire motor for $140+, in 4 years. But if ya' want, I'll let ya' know when I put the new gear in when it gets here... |
RE: ...and they're OFF
so what exactly did you replace?...or did you just disassemble and clean it out and reassemble?...
was the gear itself stripped or just those bushings were disolved?.... thanks a ton for the help! Jeff |
RE: ...and they're OFF
ORIGINAL: SC300TURBO so what exactly did you replace?...or did you just disassemble and clean it out and reassemble?... was the gear itself stripped or just those bushings were disolved?.... thanks a ton for the help! Jeff That white nylon gear was slightly shredded. You can see it in one of the pics in the case, and on my finger.I say slightly, because I just got back from evenin' service, and I got NO CLICKIN'??? None, on several open / shut cycles.[&:][&:][&:] When I did the re-assembly last night, I expected it to click, cause I didn't do anything, except check it out. And clean and lube.And it clicked. Although the thing is workin' fine now (I'm clueless on why), I'm gonna' order some nylon gears tomorrow. EDIT: And where's that shiver guy? Do you see those delrin bushings in any of my pics? I didn't see anything like the MAMotorworks catalogue picture of the bushings. I need ta know if I should order them too... |
RE: ...and they're OFF
removal of motor from assembly:
loosen bolt 4, second pic loosen bolt 2, first pic (ALSO GOOD PIC OF THIS BOLT ( in red circle) IN POST #4) you can then remove bolt 1 (it will not come out, until bolt '2' is loosened)and bolt 3, first pic, and the bolt shown is first pic of post #3, with a yellow circle. then remove the roll pin in blue circle post #4 - SEE POST 5, RED TEXT!!! ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- RE-ASSEMBLY Bolt 3 must be in place before bolt 1 is tightened. Bolt 1 must be tightened before bolt 2 is tightened. Bolt 4 - second pic, must be in place before 2 is tightened. [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/9459172F0B9C4FBDA4E2E4C4FA10E00F.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/B336A64291FB4B51AB0CBB318747D1DF.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
ORIGINAL: cwb ORIGINAL: SC300TURBO so what exactly did you replace?...or did you just disassemble and clean it out and reassemble?... was the gear itself stripped or just those bushings were disolved?.... thanks a ton for the help! Jeff That white nylon gear was slightly shredded. You can see it in one of the pics in the case, and on my finger.I say slightly, because I just got back from evenin' service, and I got NO CLICKIN'??? None, on several open / shut cycles.[&:][&:][&:] When I did the re-assembly last night, I expected it to click, cause I didn't do anything, except check it out. And clean and lube.And it clicked. Although the thing is workin' fine now (I'm clueless on why), I'm gonna' order some nylon gears tomorrow. Shiver - the delrins come integral with bronze gears, not nylon. That's why I couldn't find 'em. All I knew before was the tech writer suggested nylon gears, to not strain the motor. Now I know, and I would not choose bronze gears, EVEN IF COST WAS THE SAME FOR BOTH. |
RE: ...and they're OFF
ORIGINAL: cwb EDIT: And where's that shiver guy? Do you see those delrin bushings in any of my pics? I didn't see anything like the MAMotorworks catalogue picture of the bushings. I need ta know if I should order them too... Are those plastic bushings? I think there's suppose to be 3 of them. You have more experience with them than I do, I've never torn one down before, but, I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night. :D |
RE: ...and they're OFF
ORIGINAL: cwb It is NOT workin fine now. It is just turnin' so quietly since it's cleaned and lubed, that I can hardly hear it. Shiver - the delrins come integral with bronze gears, not nylon. That's why I couldn't find 'em. All I knew before was the tech writer suggested nylon gears, to not strain the motor. Now I know, and I would not choose bronze gears, EVEN IF COST WAS THE SAME FOR BOTH. |
RE: ...and they're OFF
Yeah thanks there...
Those things you highlighted are here: https://www.corvetteforums.com/upfil...E77BD759F7.jpg next to the manual turn knob - it's a brass bushing that the gear axle turns in. Also there are two wafer-thin washers, one is just to the right of the knob. And incidentally, those two gaskets layin' on the knob are NOT available separately. Yer probably gonna' hafta' use rtv silicone for the armature housing cover, and the gear housing cover. |
RE: ...and they're OFF
I got my headlight gear today. It looks like this:
http://corvetteamerica.com/images/ca...item_44682.jpg Someone is LOLin' HARD, cause they know I didn't come close yet, huh??? Them 3 corners in the triangle is where the delrins bushings go, and I didn't order 'em... This gear/axle assembly in my thumb and forefinger breaks down, doesn't it??? https://www.corvetteforums.com/upfil...95D2098475.jpg I'm gettin' a sick feelin' here now... Does anybody know on this thing here how it separates[sm=sick.gif][sm=sick.gif][sm=sick.gif] It's all shiver's fault[:@] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
WHAT'S UP WITH THEM HOLES!?!?!?!?! I'M ALREADYNIGHTMARE'IN' ABOUT THEM HOLES[sm=insomnia.gif][sm=insomnia.gif][sm=insomnia.gif]
There ain't no wires, no magnets, nothin'!!!!!!!!!!! Where's the sun. |
RE: ...and they're OFF
It's all shiver's fault[:@] I might as well take the blame, my wife blames me for everything too, so I'm use to it I told you I've never done one before, this is a learning experience for me too.;) Why didn't you order the bushings too, you big dummy?:D You can get em all for about six bucks, and you may still have to order em. Seems like I read that GM originally used a hard gel, and not a bushing, the after market came up with the idea to usethe bushing. Take a hammer and see if you can tap the gear off, if that don't work, find a bigger hammer.:D Seriously though, maybe the gear just snaps in place? I don't know, I'm sure if I had it in front of me I could figure it out. |
RE: ...and they're OFF
Just a little tap with the screwdriver handle...
[IMG]local://upfiles/5243/8DCB2626AC134F17BE6F6C92C3085263.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/4C88A2168A114081B2C5FD0FB29492D0.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
ORIGINAL: cwb ORIGINAL: SC300TURBO so whats the verdict...did it fix the problem? Ya' gotta find the problem before ya' fix it. Unless you're employin' the Fully Automatic Assault Wallet approach [sm=shootshoot.gif][sm=violent053.gif]Hit the problem with $340 worth of new parts and HOPE to fix it???. Not my style. I found one worn part. (no you didn't) After all parts were cleaned, greased and oiled, and re-assembled, it did exactly what I expected it to do. The same thing. And I'm gonna' go with a nylon gear - not bronze. Now that I see how easy it is, I'd still rather do it again in 3 years, than replace the entire motor for $140+, in 4 years. But if ya' want, I'll let ya' know when I put the new gear in when it gets here... Anybody need a nylon gear??? [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/FEBB9A92B6534CFB8E67059C4EF9057A.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/ABFEFA096A0649309BE51A7E6F5A0B07.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
Looks like the, (cough) delrins bushings are shot.
Now we know, the rest of the story. BTW...that used gear doesn't look that bad, is there any wear on it? |
RE: ...and they're OFF
ORIGINAL: rshiver Looks like the, (cough) delrins bushings are shot. Now we know, the rest of the story. I don't know - somethin' is still sayin' thisgig ain't over... It did take only 50 minutes to drop the light and get inside, disassemble, and re-assemble... BTW...that used gear doesn't look that bad, is there any wear on it? I just got the bushings ordered. I'm not gonna' send the new gear back yet tho', till I see the new bushings in my old gear. But there's not a lick of wear, even where the metal triangle turned without any bushings inside - see pic. Makes another case for nylon over bronze too;). Now - let's see if I can clean the K & N in my little Jimmy, without jammin' it up:eek: |
RE: ...and they're OFF
See pics below for motor disassembly
The delrins came from Corvette America on saturday. With these Eckler's instructions???: For #4, if you pull the armature housing too far out (I think you have no choice), you'll have to do the fishing line trick to hold the brushes back in - see earlier post this thread. I didn't mention earlier, DO take note of the position of the nylon gear axle - fig 2 here. Because when you pull the worm drive out, it will turn the gear a little bit back, like the distributor coming away from your camshaft. What kinda' grease do you use guys??? Thanks for THAT info:eek: [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/67C5457B3E694F11BFFA5E2F3678910B.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/CDF4B209856145D6A33F2E2AD5200D5D.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
I figure a good whitelithium grease would be a good choice.
BTW, I know you could write your own since you've done the repair, but I found this article on the repair, may help somebody in the future. http://content.madirect.com/pdf/601701article.pdf |
RE: ...and they're OFF
ORIGINAL: rshiver I figure a good whitelithium grease would be a good choice. BTW, I know you could write your own since you've done the repair, but I found this article on the repair, may help somebody in the future. http://content.madirect.com/pdf/601701article.pdf Lithium is what the first 3 google hits said for nylon. THEN, the fourth hit was nylon servo gears for rc helicopters. Said use slick 50. Right answer!!! It has PTFE teflon, which is nylonplastic in oil. (the 3rd hit was your fiero link. the guy said a friend of his used rtv silicone, INSTEAD of new bushings???)[&:] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
dup post
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RE: ...and they're OFF
Hmmm, I guessRTV silicone would probably work, but it would have to set for a while so itwould be firm enough to hold.
But, ....you're doing it thecorrect way. ;) |
RE: ...and they're OFF
Another thought too....RTV silicone can be pretty tough, and on down the road if something malfunctions, it may not give like the delrin bushings are designed to do. He could end up replacing a burn out motor instead of a set of six dollar bushings.
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RE: ...and they're OFF
The top panel exterior seems pretty snug on the assembly. Can't remember who lost theirs here...
I could not twist the blade at all. [IMG]local://upfiles/5243/9A09B8EADF394238B0F141D99EA875B5.jpg[/IMG] |
RE: ...and they're OFF
It was red90vettesc.
Be carefull, and don't mess it up, I'd hate to see a grown man cry. :D |
RE: ...and they're OFF
ORIGINAL: rshiver It was red90vettesc. Be carefull, and don't mess it up, I'd hate to see a grown man cry. :D Viewers: all text in thread is edited for procedure, with pictures left for reference... |
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