C4 Headers
#1
10-30-2006, 09:15 AM
C4 Headers
Hey Guys!,
How much of a bitch would it be to put in some headers into the 86 vette, would the motor have to brought up any? or could it stay on the mounts, what happens with the EGR thinger? Has anyone done this? etc.... Thanks!!!!!
#2
10-30-2006, 05:38 PM
RE: C4 Headers
You buy a good set and you can get them on without having to remove the engine or even loosen the motor mounts.
The amount of cussing and swearing you do will be a direct function of how much work room you have under the car: if you get it up on a lift (you will want to take it up and down a few times) it will not be a big hassle. It you have it only on ramps in the driveway your language will frighten the neighbors.
The amount of cussing and swearing you do will be a direct function of how much work room you have under the car: if you get it up on a lift (you will want to take it up and down a few times) it will not be a big hassle. It you have it only on ramps in the driveway your language will frighten the neighbors.
#3
10-30-2006, 06:46 PM
RE: C4 Headers
Aye, 
I see groovy!!!!
[IMG]local://upfiles/3562/E201B54CD90441DBB8BF0DE0CAA11D23.jpg[/IMG]
I see groovy!!!![IMG]local://upfiles/3562/E201B54CD90441DBB8BF0DE0CAA11D23.jpg[/IMG]
#5
11-07-2006, 08:51 PM
RE: C4 Headers
Header instalation instructions...Left side is hell
Needed:
2 sets Percy's soft alum. 3" collector gaskets #PHP-66002 $14.95, not needed with TPiS headers.
Fel-Pro #1406 header gaskets #FPP-1406 $15.95
Stage 8 locking header bolts #STG-8911A $43.95, do not work with TPiS headers, since they have spacers put on to allow use of stock bolts. Hooker, they will.
Summit part# DEI-010409 or THE-14002 heat tape
Possibly an $18 Dipstick Tube
Starter issues?
For 84-87 Corvettes, you have the large behemoth factory starter, this will need replacement by a smaller starter if you ever plan to take your starter off in the future for any reason. Its just too big to get around the header. 88-91 and LT1 starters are much smaller and made by Denso, and they will fit without issues. FYI, we use a 153-tooth flywheel. Some people will have clearance issues, some won't.
Now, put some Liquid Wrench or PB Blaster on the Y-pipe bolts and main cat bolts (if yours has them and isnt slip-fit) over night before starting this project.
Right side from above.
Remove the spark plugs, wires, oil filter, and it goes in from the top. Also the alternator bracket that secures to one of the header bolts. It helps to have the front of the car off the ground with this side too. That's it.This is the easy side. That particular rear brace will not go back on with Hooker headers, so you will have to custom fabricate something to go in its place or you WILL eventually crack your alternator. This is exacerbated by anyone who has already deleted AIR as most AIR eliminator setups are torsionally weaker than the OEM brace.
Left side from below.
Remove the starter, starter/flywheel cover, plugs, wires, and that long AIR hose that went to your main cat. The dipstick will could get in your way, but the ac unit ect. shouldnt. You need the front of the car pretty high off the ground. The valve into the main cat is supposed to be one-way, so not capping it shouldnt be an issue.
You might also have to remove the diagonal frame brace on this side that goes from the back of the front wheel and meets in the center below the oil pan. Try getting the header in first and see if it will go up high enough to align the bolt holes on the head without catching the corner of this brace before you remove it. Mine caught the corner of this brace and did not allow the header to go up enought to align the bolt holes on the head. I just simply grinded down this corner, cause once the headers are bolted on, you will not have room to screw that top bolt into place. So if you pull this brace, make sure you tighten this upper brace bolt back down while the header is in place BUT NOT YET bolted on, because you won't have room once the headers are bolted. You must install the header and the starter at the same time. That means bolt the starter into place while the header is in but not yet bolted to the head.
Also, when you got the headers in place and ready to bolt them onto the heads on either side, start with the header bolts that have the pipe more bent towards them. Reason is because some of the pipes bend real close to the bolt hole, and if you bolt all the rest of the bolts in place and have the headers flush on the heads, you might not be able to get some of the remaining bolts started because the bolt head will hit the pipe. You will have to loosen the bolts, pull the header away from the heads, hand start each bolt and tighten in turns as you move the header against the head.
Use the Fel-Pro 1406 gaskets for a better seal than those that came with the headers. There only like $20 and they are reuseable. Same goes for the collector gaskets. Those that come with the headers blow out easy. Get the Percy's dead soft aluminum ones instead for the collectors.
Use anti-seize compound on the collector bolts and the header bolts, if you have aluminum heads this is a must. Do not use Loctite, it breaks down at 450F and is useless.
YOU MUST RETIGHTEN THE BOLTS AFTER A FEW HEAT CYCLES. They will eventually back out if you cant use the stage 8 locking bolts, and those are not useable on TPiS headers.
The last header bolt closest to the firewall on the passanger's side is going to be a bitch to install. Specially if you have big hands. Try to use a small 1/4 drive ratchet with a short flex joint on a 5/16 socket to tighten it from the top. Or you can heat up and bend a wrench into an L shape to get to it. It's not easy. Some people use a very long wrench with success, its up to you, but be prepared to curse profusely.
A major gotcha, do not tighten all the bolts until the Y-pipe is on the headers. Otherwise it may not want to go on at all.
If you bought Hooker's matching front y-pipe and your Vette is an automatic, expect the y-pipe to not clear the transmission pan. It's going to hit the corner and not go up all the way to seal at the collectors. Had to take mine to a muffler shop, have the corner cut out and replaced with a secton of 3" pipe that had a longer sweep to clear the pan. TPiS headers fit better than this though.
Hooker 2149's have a slotted bolt hole flange for that pesky #8 bolt so you could start the #8 bolt and gasket and then slide the header flange into place then start the other bolts. It's tough to get that one started once header is in place.
Best tip I have is to start all header bolts but dont tighten them. This allows a slight bit of moveability to line up the collectors to Y pipe. Then start the collector bolts but dont tighten them. Now tighten the headers then comeback and tighten the collectors to Y pipe.
The Dipstick, before you break it or make it weak...
go to the hardware store and get a two cable clamps and a piece of cable.. clamp the cable to the dipstick tube nake sure its tight but don't crush the tube.. then attach the other end of the cable to a slide hammer and gently work the slide hammer... be careful to pull on it in a straight direction ..BINGO tube comes out without breaking it off or having to remove the pan. Its put in with a GM adhesive sealer, so on old cars its not going to want to come out.
A.I.R. and EGR issues
When I installed my own TPiS headers, I deleted everything smog-related other than the main cat.
I used a Breathless AIR eliminator kit, ordered through ExoticMuscle. They will stick you on prices so you might want to check to see how much they charge you, it may be different than what they tell you on the phone, mine was off by $20 from what I was quoted. The wiring can be left alone, it doesnt throw a code. I yanked all the piping off the car as well.
I ordered the EGR blockoff plate from a forum member, the part offered on Summit wasnt correct. I simply cut the green wire to the solenoid/switch at the back of the manifold and yanked off the pipe. The headers were plug welded on #8 so I couldnt use it anyway. I have had no codes for either AIR or EGR.
The Tpis, LPE and Hooker 2149 have all these things already available when bought new, so you dont have to delete anything at all. Hooker 2151 is a bare header and you'll have to ditch both AIR and EGR to use
Installing a 3-wire Heated Oxygen Sensor
This is primarily advisable if you have headers. Headers tend to cool the exhast gasses down, which in turn can affect Oxygen Sensor performance. To combat this, a self-heated sensor can be installed, to ensure proper operation regardless of exhaust temp, and also provide shorter times to closed loop operation. I will spare you the details on actually installing the sensor, since it doesn't take a brain surgeon, just a 7/8" wrench, sensor socket, or crowsfoot and some of your time.
The reason for this article is to explain how to properly wire it up. First, you will need the parts. I perfer to use AC Delco parts. The quality is unsurpassed. Also to ensure proper installation, and easy replacement in the
Needed:
2 sets Percy's soft alum. 3" collector gaskets #PHP-66002 $14.95, not needed with TPiS headers.
Fel-Pro #1406 header gaskets #FPP-1406 $15.95
Stage 8 locking header bolts #STG-8911A $43.95, do not work with TPiS headers, since they have spacers put on to allow use of stock bolts. Hooker, they will.
Summit part# DEI-010409 or THE-14002 heat tape
Possibly an $18 Dipstick Tube
Starter issues?
For 84-87 Corvettes, you have the large behemoth factory starter, this will need replacement by a smaller starter if you ever plan to take your starter off in the future for any reason. Its just too big to get around the header. 88-91 and LT1 starters are much smaller and made by Denso, and they will fit without issues. FYI, we use a 153-tooth flywheel. Some people will have clearance issues, some won't.
Now, put some Liquid Wrench or PB Blaster on the Y-pipe bolts and main cat bolts (if yours has them and isnt slip-fit) over night before starting this project.
Right side from above.
Remove the spark plugs, wires, oil filter, and it goes in from the top. Also the alternator bracket that secures to one of the header bolts. It helps to have the front of the car off the ground with this side too. That's it.This is the easy side. That particular rear brace will not go back on with Hooker headers, so you will have to custom fabricate something to go in its place or you WILL eventually crack your alternator. This is exacerbated by anyone who has already deleted AIR as most AIR eliminator setups are torsionally weaker than the OEM brace.
Left side from below.
Remove the starter, starter/flywheel cover, plugs, wires, and that long AIR hose that went to your main cat. The dipstick will could get in your way, but the ac unit ect. shouldnt. You need the front of the car pretty high off the ground. The valve into the main cat is supposed to be one-way, so not capping it shouldnt be an issue.
You might also have to remove the diagonal frame brace on this side that goes from the back of the front wheel and meets in the center below the oil pan. Try getting the header in first and see if it will go up high enough to align the bolt holes on the head without catching the corner of this brace before you remove it. Mine caught the corner of this brace and did not allow the header to go up enought to align the bolt holes on the head. I just simply grinded down this corner, cause once the headers are bolted on, you will not have room to screw that top bolt into place. So if you pull this brace, make sure you tighten this upper brace bolt back down while the header is in place BUT NOT YET bolted on, because you won't have room once the headers are bolted. You must install the header and the starter at the same time. That means bolt the starter into place while the header is in but not yet bolted to the head.
Also, when you got the headers in place and ready to bolt them onto the heads on either side, start with the header bolts that have the pipe more bent towards them. Reason is because some of the pipes bend real close to the bolt hole, and if you bolt all the rest of the bolts in place and have the headers flush on the heads, you might not be able to get some of the remaining bolts started because the bolt head will hit the pipe. You will have to loosen the bolts, pull the header away from the heads, hand start each bolt and tighten in turns as you move the header against the head.
Use the Fel-Pro 1406 gaskets for a better seal than those that came with the headers. There only like $20 and they are reuseable. Same goes for the collector gaskets. Those that come with the headers blow out easy. Get the Percy's dead soft aluminum ones instead for the collectors.
Use anti-seize compound on the collector bolts and the header bolts, if you have aluminum heads this is a must. Do not use Loctite, it breaks down at 450F and is useless.
YOU MUST RETIGHTEN THE BOLTS AFTER A FEW HEAT CYCLES. They will eventually back out if you cant use the stage 8 locking bolts, and those are not useable on TPiS headers.
The last header bolt closest to the firewall on the passanger's side is going to be a bitch to install. Specially if you have big hands. Try to use a small 1/4 drive ratchet with a short flex joint on a 5/16 socket to tighten it from the top. Or you can heat up and bend a wrench into an L shape to get to it. It's not easy. Some people use a very long wrench with success, its up to you, but be prepared to curse profusely.
A major gotcha, do not tighten all the bolts until the Y-pipe is on the headers. Otherwise it may not want to go on at all.
If you bought Hooker's matching front y-pipe and your Vette is an automatic, expect the y-pipe to not clear the transmission pan. It's going to hit the corner and not go up all the way to seal at the collectors. Had to take mine to a muffler shop, have the corner cut out and replaced with a secton of 3" pipe that had a longer sweep to clear the pan. TPiS headers fit better than this though.
Hooker 2149's have a slotted bolt hole flange for that pesky #8 bolt so you could start the #8 bolt and gasket and then slide the header flange into place then start the other bolts. It's tough to get that one started once header is in place.
Best tip I have is to start all header bolts but dont tighten them. This allows a slight bit of moveability to line up the collectors to Y pipe. Then start the collector bolts but dont tighten them. Now tighten the headers then comeback and tighten the collectors to Y pipe.
The Dipstick, before you break it or make it weak...
go to the hardware store and get a two cable clamps and a piece of cable.. clamp the cable to the dipstick tube nake sure its tight but don't crush the tube.. then attach the other end of the cable to a slide hammer and gently work the slide hammer... be careful to pull on it in a straight direction ..BINGO tube comes out without breaking it off or having to remove the pan. Its put in with a GM adhesive sealer, so on old cars its not going to want to come out.
A.I.R. and EGR issues
When I installed my own TPiS headers, I deleted everything smog-related other than the main cat.
I used a Breathless AIR eliminator kit, ordered through ExoticMuscle. They will stick you on prices so you might want to check to see how much they charge you, it may be different than what they tell you on the phone, mine was off by $20 from what I was quoted. The wiring can be left alone, it doesnt throw a code. I yanked all the piping off the car as well.
I ordered the EGR blockoff plate from a forum member, the part offered on Summit wasnt correct. I simply cut the green wire to the solenoid/switch at the back of the manifold and yanked off the pipe. The headers were plug welded on #8 so I couldnt use it anyway. I have had no codes for either AIR or EGR.
The Tpis, LPE and Hooker 2149 have all these things already available when bought new, so you dont have to delete anything at all. Hooker 2151 is a bare header and you'll have to ditch both AIR and EGR to use
Installing a 3-wire Heated Oxygen Sensor
This is primarily advisable if you have headers. Headers tend to cool the exhast gasses down, which in turn can affect Oxygen Sensor performance. To combat this, a self-heated sensor can be installed, to ensure proper operation regardless of exhaust temp, and also provide shorter times to closed loop operation. I will spare you the details on actually installing the sensor, since it doesn't take a brain surgeon, just a 7/8" wrench, sensor socket, or crowsfoot and some of your time.
The reason for this article is to explain how to properly wire it up. First, you will need the parts. I perfer to use AC Delco parts. The quality is unsurpassed. Also to ensure proper installation, and easy replacement in the
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